Crazy Bible Stories

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Water coming from below is not from one individual source like one single gargantuan tap or that there is one-only great-drain when water could easily finds it's way throught the cracks of the earth e.g. levels receding all over the place.

There would be tsunami like forces on EVERY coastline when waters rise up. I would assume valleys below sea-level, would have similar effects like dams bursting. We know the devastation effects of heavy rain in just a few days in low-lands and large area flat-lands that are known to have monsoons.

The Noah fable has water rising at the rate of 725 feet every day. At that ridiculous rate there will be immediate and widespread devastation in the first minutes. Also, I'm not arguing for a single source. Obviously water would be squeezing out everywhere, a point I thought I made quite well when I talked about Hurricane Ivan in my area years ago. This was precisely what happened. And Hurricane Ivan's rain didn't amount to a morning sprinkle compared to what the Noah fable would have us believe.

 

[Lion IRC]

The really weird bit is that the Bible spells out a fairly detailed description of how 'The Flood' happened. The Bible is supposedly the 'word of god'. Lion claims to believe the Bible and yet, in this case, he decides that the Bible doesn't really mean what it says. However for some reason he claims to know what god really meant to say.

Neither story makes any sense but the one offered by Lion seems to be the most wacky.

Hello!!!
I'm the fundy here. Not you.
I'm the one who takes the bible literally.
I don't need a "wacky theory" to get around inconvenient biblical texts regarding the Flood.

I suggest you read back over your posts. You have been writing your own bible because none of the shit you are claiming is in the Bible. You may need to read the Bible too if you are as unaware of its description of the flood as you seem to be.

You have yet to show where I have contradicted anything in the bible.

You have not explained why mega-tsunamis and earthquakes would be inconsistent with a global deluge and huge shifts of subterranean water.

I post an infographic explaining how the height of seawater above land need not be uniform at all times - a mountain top could be temporarily covered by water. And all you can do is whine about hermeneutics and stamp your feet because the word tsunami isn't in the bible.

 

[Lion IRC]

Did the fundamentalist just say that there is Biblical text that is inconvenient?

The inerrant and literal word of god is inconvenient?

If would only be an inconvenient bible verse if I DID need a wacky theory to explain it.

skepticalbip doesn't get to assert that the (pretty ambiguous) text of Genesis 7/8 can only be read one way.

 

[James Brown]

I suggest you read back over your posts. You have been writing your own bible because none of the shit you are claiming is in the Bible. You may need to read the Bible too if you are as unaware of its description of the flood as you seem to be.

You have yet to show where I have contradicted anything in the bible.

You have not explained why mega-tsunamis and earthquakes would be inconsistent with a global deluge and huge shifts of subterranean water.

I post an infographic explaining how the height of seawater above land need not be uniform at all times - a mountain top could be temporarily covered by water. And all you can do is whine about hermeneutics and stamp your feet because the word tsunami isn't in the bible.

Wouldn't a tsunami big enough to cover Mt. Everest also swamp Noah's ark entirely?

 

[skepticalbip]

I suggest you read back over your posts. You have been writing your own bible because none of the shit you are claiming is in the Bible. You may need to read the Bible too if you are as unaware of its description of the flood as you seem to be.

You have yet to show where I have contradicted anything in the bible.

You have not explained why mega-tsunamis and earthquakes would be inconsistent with a global deluge and huge shifts of subterranean water.

I post an infographic explaining how the height of seawater above land need not be uniform at all times - a mountain top could be temporarily covered by water. And all you can do is whine about hermeneutics and stamp your feet because the word tsunami isn't in the bible.

Because your scenario contradicts the fairly detailed account given in the Bible. It says that the rain and water gushing from springs flooded the Earth to cover even the highest mountains. Those mountain tops above the waters you claim a tsunami washed over would not be there.

Genesis 7

17 For forty days the flood kept coming on the earth, and as the waters increased they lifted the ark high above the earth. 18 The waters rose and increased greatly on the earth, and the ark floated on the surface of the water. 19 They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. 20 The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits.

Genesis clearly says that the flood covered the mountains, not that they were still poking out to be temporarily sloshed over. Also Noah was looking for signs of land and couldn't find it. He sent birds out who could find no where to land until finally the flood receded enough.

Your assertion of mountains poking out above the flood is an obvious contradiction of 'The Flood' account.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Because your scenario contradicts the fairly detailed account given in the Bible. It says that the rain and water gushing from springs flooded the Earth to cover even the highest mountains. Those mountain tops above the waters you claim a tsunami washed over would not be there.

Genesis 7

17 For forty days the flood kept coming on the earth, and as the waters increased they lifted the ark high above the earth. 18 The waters rose and increased greatly on the earth, and the ark floated on the surface of the water. 19 They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. 20 The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits.

Genesis clearly says that the flood covered the mountains, not that they were still poking out to be temporarily sloshed over. Also Noah was looking for signs of land and couldn't find it. He sent birds out who could find no where to land until finally the flood receded enough.

Your assertion of mountains poking out above the flood is an obvious contradiction of 'The Flood' account.

The tsunami must have kept moving with Noah's magic boat resting upon it's crest and well above the highest peaks else the boat would have been crushed upon rocks, as happens.

Anything is possible with gods at the helm.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The specs to build the boat were ambiguous. The flooding itself was rather descriptive.

 

[Learner]

Because your scenario contradicts the fairly detailed account given in the Bible. It says that the rain and water gushing from springs flooded the Earth to cover even the highest mountains. Those mountain tops above the waters you claim a tsunami washed over would not be there.

Genesis 7

17 For forty days the flood kept coming on the earth, and as the waters increased they lifted the ark high above the earth. 18 The waters rose and increased greatly on the earth, and the ark floated on the surface of the water. 19 They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. 20 The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits.

Genesis clearly says that the flood covered the mountains, not that they were still poking out to be temporarily sloshed over. Also Noah was looking for signs of land and couldn't find it. He sent birds out who could find no where to land until finally the flood receded enough.

Your assertion of mountains poking out above the flood is an obvious contradiction of 'The Flood' account.

Just say briefly ...

Mountains were covered (not for so long) - temporarly covered:

YOriginaaly posted by Lion

I post an infographic explaining how the height of seawater above land need not be uniform at all times - a mountain top could be temporarily covered by water. And all you can do is whine about hermeneutics and stamp your feet because the word tsunami isn't in the bible.

 

[Lion IRC]

I suggest you read back over your posts. You have been writing your own bible because none of the shit you are claiming is in the Bible. You may need to read the Bible too if you are as unaware of its description of the flood as you seem to be.

You have yet to show where I have contradicted anything in the bible.

You have not explained why mega-tsunamis and earthquakes would be inconsistent with a global deluge and huge shifts of subterranean water.

I post an infographic explaining how the height of seawater above land need not be uniform at all times - a mountain top could be temporarily covered by water. And all you can do is whine about hermeneutics and stamp your feet because the word tsunami isn't in the bible.

Wouldn't a tsunami big enough to cover Mt. Everest also swamp Noah's ark entirely?

Mt Everest is not a floating object. That's why it got submer...

Oh, I see what you're doing. Get Lion IRC to speculate on events that aren't mentioned in Genesis so someone can come and accuse me of making up stuff .
Well played.

So...since Mt Everest isn't specifically mentioned in Genesis, nor it's height above sea level, it would be unwise to assume an imaginary height of the tsunami.

Suffice to say The Titanic was designed and built by men.
Noah's Ark was God's handiwork.
So we have no reason to doubt the bible's account of it surviving The Flood - tsunamis or no.

 

[James Brown]

So we have no reason to doubt the bible's account of it surviving The Flood - tsunamis or no.

Some of us have reasons to doubt the account. To accept the Genesis account at face value requires accepting bad science, bad engineering, or magic.

Problems with a Global Flood

Wood is not the best material for shipbuilding. It is not enough that a ship be built to hold together; it must also be sturdy enough that the changing stresses don't open gaps in its hull. Wood is simply not strong enough to prevent separation between the joints, especially in the heavy seas [Edited to add--'tsunamis'] that the Ark would have encountered. The longest wooden ships in modern seas are about 300 feet, and these require reinforcing with iron straps and leak so badly they must be constantly pumped. The ark was 450 feet long [ Gen. 6:15]. Could an ark that size be made seaworthy?

 

[skepticalbip]

Just say briefly ...

Mountains were covered (not for so long) - temporarly covered:

YOriginaaly posted by Lion

I post an infographic explaining how the height of seawater above land need not be uniform at all times - a mountain top could be temporarily covered by water. And all you can do is whine about hermeneutics and stamp your feet because the word tsunami isn't in the bible.

I suggest that you carefully read Genesis 7 and Gemesis 8, carefully and for comprehension. It claims that the mountains were covered for several months like the rest of the Earth (minus a few weeks since they were the last to be covered when the flood rose and the first to emerge as the flood subsided.)

ETA:
This is really weird. An atheist who has read the Bible and a Christian theist that hasn't.

 

[James Brown]

17 For forty days the flood kept coming on the earth, and as the waters increased they lifted the ark high above the earth.18 The waters rose and increased greatly on the earth, and the ark floated on the surface of the water.19 They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered.20 The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits.[

I'm curious who measured this?

 

[bigfield]

Just say briefly ...

Mountains were covered (not for so long) - temporarly covered:

YOriginaaly posted by Lion

I post an infographic explaining how the height of seawater above land need not be uniform at all times - a mountain top could be temporarily covered by water. And all you can do is whine about hermeneutics and stamp your feet because the word tsunami isn't in the bible.

I suggest that you carefully read Genesis 7 and Gemesis 8 carefully and for comprehension.

Indeed. Temporarily covered for 150 days, not temporarily covered by a big wave.

¹⁷ For forty days the flood kept coming on the earth, and as the waters increased they lifted the ark high above the earth. ¹⁸ The waters rose and increased greatly on the earth, and the ark floated on the surface of the water. ¹⁹ They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. ²⁰ The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits.^[a]...²⁴ The waters flooded the earth for a hundred and fifty days.

^a That is, about 23 feet or about 6.8 meters
^b Or rose more than fifteen cubits, and the mountains were covered

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis+7&version=NIV

Maybe God just sent a big wave around the planet continuously for forty days, just to make sure all the mountainous regions got a good rinse.

 

[Keith&Co.]

[FONT=&]17 For forty days the flood kept coming on the earth, and as the waters increased they lifted the ark high above the earth.[/FONT][FONT=&]18 The waters rose and increased greatly on the earth, and the ark floated on the surface of the water.[/FONT][FONT=&]19 They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered.[/FONT][FONT=&]20 The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits.[[/FONT]

I'm curious who measured this?

The submarine launched ballistic missile has a porous surface, so when we pressurize the tube before launch, we pressurize the missile's skin.
At launch, the drop in pressure allows the nitrogen to sweat back out as the missile rises through the water. Depending on who you talk to at Lockheed, it minimizes the water's impact on the missile's rise OR it keeps the missile completely dry on the way up.
The guy that sat in the rowboat and felt the missile going by to check that it was dry? That's the guy, measured the depth on the mountain's top.
Name is Phil.
Nice guy.
Flinches a lot.

 

[Keith&Co.]

Indeed. Temporarily covered for 150 days, not temporarily covered by a big wave.

That big wave cresting over the mountain tops, how does that impact those claims of clam fossils found on top of Everest proving the Flood?

 

[atrib]

From all the evidence we have today, from diverse fields like geology, paleontology, archaeology, genetics and many more scientific disciplines, we KNOW that earth was not covered by water to the top of the highest mountains at any time within the last 10,000 years. It is irrelevant where this water might have come from, or how a boat could have survived this event, or how the animals were first collected and later distributed back all over the globe, or how the various civilizations that were scattered around the planet at the time never noticed that they all been drowned in a flood. A flood of the magnitude described in the Bible would have left indelible physical evidence all over the planet, and in the genes of all living things. And this evidence does not exist. Debating the minutia of the story while ignoring the big picture is a fruitless exercise.

 

[Keith&Co.]

Debating the minutia of the story while ignoring the big picture is a fruitless exercise.

Pointing out yet another flaw in the whole story is not the same as ignoring the big picture.
It is fun to watch the faithful run around trying to plug another hole in the story's hull, trying to keep it afloat even though it's crashed on the rocks.
But there's not even a pretense that "If you can solve 'where the water went,' the story becomes tenable." Or "figure the food problem, we'll move it to 'possible' if not 'plausible,' okay?"

Exactly the same as any argument over Picard vs. Kirk, no matter how it's resolved, will never make any Trek fan actually begin to think that Trek is historically accurate.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

You have not explained why mega-tsunamis and earthquakes would be inconsistent with a global deluge and huge shifts of subterranean water.

What caused "huge shifts of subterranean water?" God magic?

17 For forty days the flood kept coming on the earth, and as the waters increased they lifted the ark high above the earth.18 The waters rose and increased greatly on the earth, and the ark floated on the surface of the water.19 They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered.20 The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits.[

I'm curious who measured this?

The part about Noah being pretty handy with a jerk-line was deleted by later scribes.

Maybe God just sent a big wave around the planet continuously for forty days, just to make sure all the mountainous regions got a good rinse.

The crest of the 30,000 foot tsunami was 150 days long. Impressive.

 

[Sarpedon]

And how did the big, wooden barge survive the big wave?

Making up your religion, one wild supposition at a time!

If you are going to do this sort of thing, you had better be able to keep more than one idea in your head at once. Remember, this whole story revolves around the Ark. If you make up something to clear up a minor detail, you had better be sure that it doesn't nullify the main point of the story!

Religious people: bad at science, worse at storytelling.

 

[Learner]

We seem to be stuck on the BIG WAVE scenario it seems. The water rose and the ark only needed to float.