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Are we headed for a crack-up boom?

boneyard bill

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Ludwig Von Mises, the famous Austrian School economist described what he called a "crack-up" boom. We all know that when governments expand the money supply it creates inflation. This is not hotly debated among economists. There are limits to how much and how long governments can intervene to expand credit and money creation without suffering serious consequences. Nonetheless, governments are greatly tempted to do this because such policies create a short-boom in the economy and this is especially helpful if you are a president and can bring it about at re-election time. (Ref: George W. Bush, 2004).

But a crack-up boom is different. A crack-up boom is ultimately caused by monetary expansion, but the immediate cause is a loss in public confidence in the currency. When people come to expect prices to rise rapidly, they tend to spend their money more quickly. So regular monetary expansion then becomes supplemented by an increase in money velocity. This leads to even higher levels of inflation until you finally reach the point where confidence in the currency in completely lost, and you get very high inflation or even hyper-inflation.

In Weimar Germany you got hyper-inflation. In Argentina and Brazil we saw very high inflation for most of the second half of the 20th Century. Brazil has mostly solved here problem but Argentina has returned to this path, and Venezuela has been pursuing it ever since Chavez got elected. The U.S. came very close to this in the 1970's as the consumer price index reached over 20% at one point and led President Carter to dump his Fed Chairman, William Miller, and appoint Paul Volcker as his replacement.

Today doesn't seem to be so serious. The inflation rate is low. But that is deceiving. First of all, by '70 accounting methods, the CPI would be in high single digits. But the CPI only measures consumer price inflation. It doesn't measure asset price inflation. Asset price inflation is what we call a "bubble," and we are currently experiences bubbles in the stock market, the bond market, and real estate.

But what is worrisome is not just the situation in the US. The rest of world is in much the same situation. Money is created when banks lend, and debt, both public and private, is at all time highs in the developed and much of the developing world. But the US, Europe, and Japan seem to be in the worst shape. Greece is just the tip of the ice berg. This debt can only be serviced by creating more money. Internal economic growth is insufficient and higher taxes would cut growth even more. Slashes in government spending would have to be huge and would create humanitarian problems. Besides, cutting the welfare state dramatically is simply not possible politically.

So the US, Europe, and Japan at the very least, seem to be headed toward a crack-up boom. They can only service their debt creating money, and that money must ultimately produce an increase in consumer prices which will then accelerate money velocity and ultimately create a crisis of confidence their currencies. When confidence in a fiat currency is lost, the end result is a collapse in the currency altogether.

Of course, we may never reach that point. We could see a major collapse of the Western economies due to the collapse of the bubbles they have created. In other worlds asset price inflation may wreck the world economy before consumer price inflation gets a chance. In this case the currency would actually gain value as money and debt disappear due to bankruptcies and defaults. But given the biases of the majority of economists, not to mention the interests of politicians, the likely reaction to bursting bubbles would be more money creation which would ultimately lead to consumer price inflation with an ultimately loss in confidence in the currency anyway.

At present, it looks like bubbles are going to start to burst very soon. In fact, we're already seeing one in the Chinese stock market, but the Chinese government has put their finger in dike for the moment. However, bad as the Chinese situation looks, circumstances in the US, Europe, and Japan look far worse in their fundamentals.

We are headed for hard times ahead. Bursting bubbles could tank the world economy at any time. If those somehow hold off, however, would could still be looking at a crack-up boom not much farther down the road. Of course, because the whole thing depends on confidence in the major currencies, it is impossible to predict a time-frame with any certainty.
 
According to the "chicken little economists" we have been heading for hard times or hyperinflation for a long time. Somehow, we always manage to avoid those dire forecasts.
 
That little bald headed weasel who ran the Fed for years and his minions did what they did and called it Quantitative Easing....making it easier for the big banks to grow bigger with all the "air money"....just money for bank balancing's sake. If you think Bernanke ever cared about what happens to you, you are very sadly mistaken. The funny part is...he is gone but all his faux money is not. We got a mini stimulus followed by a huge does of "easing." It may be too late to start listening to Stiglitz. We need fitting and proper fiscal policies (spending only on things society NEEDS) and tax policies that support that spending. We need the kind of leadership that is looking to see all the boats rise, if only a little bit. Instead we have clowns like Trump trying to be our president and actually impressing a lot of very misguided Americans.
 
Harry Dent and/or Peter Schiff would tell you just the opposite. That we are about to experience deflation in the near future.

As I currently understand it, there are 2 major forces right now. The first force is the creation of money Boneyard mentions in the OP. But the second force is the serious low oil price we have because of Saudia Arabia and will get even lower because of Iran's successful negotiation with Obama. Low oil causes everything to get cheaper and also causes unemployment in the oil and steel making sectors. Real unemployment is much higher than stated and the middle class people who do have jobs do not see a robust economy to go out and consume. Add to that fact that no one is getting interest so no one is earning money on savings anymore.

Then to makes things even more complex then they already are, our government has been instrumental causing gold price to be lower than it should by selling huge amounts of paper shorts at night.

I don't see how anyone can predict what will happen at this point.
 
According to the "chicken little economists" we have been heading for hard times or hyperinflation for a long time. Somehow, we always manage to avoid those dire forecasts.


I remember this book that was being hawked by a right wing radio host. I actually got the pamphlet version (it was free and I was broke). It warned of the dire consequences of our unsustainable debt that was skyrocketing under a Democratic President. We were headed towards the nightmare scenario that was also the prophetic title of the book: (cue ominous music)


Bankruptcy 1995



:eek:
 
There was an anti-Clinton industry just as much as there is an anti-Obama industry.

Rail against Obama, write a book, and you can make a good living talking to Republican audiences these days.
 
The last time I tried to buy Gold I got Piracy instead.
 
Harry Dent and/or Peter Schiff would tell you just the opposite. That we are about to experience deflation in the near future.

As I currently understand it, there are 2 major forces right now. The first force is the creation of money Boneyard mentions in the OP. But the second force is the serious low oil price we have because of Saudia Arabia and will get even lower because of Iran's successful negotiation with Obama. Low oil causes everything to get cheaper and also causes unemployment in the oil and steel making sectors. Real unemployment is much higher than stated and the middle class people who do have jobs do not see a robust economy to go out and consume. Add to that fact that no one is getting interest so no one is earning money on savings anymore.

Then to makes things even more complex then they already are, our government has been instrumental causing gold price to be lower than it should by selling huge amounts of paper shorts at night.

I don't see how anyone can predict what will happen at this point.

The gold price has been insanely high for decades. The only thing propping it up is that everyone in the market knows that everyone else in the market is batshit insane.

Gold is useful in small quantities for jewelery, dental prostheses, optical coatings, some electronic components, and decoration (gold leaf). None of these uses could possibly ever soak up the amount of refined gold currently stored in vaults worldwide; that gold is valuable for no reason other than that people have decided to value it. It will never, ever, be used for any purpose; it will sit in vaults until people realise it is inherently valueless, and then it will presumably be stacked up somewhere where people who want some can help themselves.

Of course, that doesn't mean you can get rich by shorting gold; The market can remain irrational for far longer than you can remain solvent.
 
That little bald headed weasel who ran the Fed for years and his minions did what they did and called it Quantitative Easing....making it easier for the big banks to grow bigger with all the "air money"....just money for bank balancing's sake. If you think Bernanke ever cared about what happens to you, you are very sadly mistaken. The funny part is...he is gone but all his faux money is not. We got a mini stimulus followed by a huge does of "easing." It may be too late to start listening to Stiglitz. We need fitting and proper fiscal policies (spending only on things society NEEDS) and tax policies that support that spending. We need the kind of leadership that is looking to see all the boats rise, if only a little bit. Instead we have clowns like Trump trying to be our president and actually impressing a lot of very misguided Americans.

I agree with most of this. Bernanke's so-called stimulus of quantitative easing was just a pretext for bailing out the Wall Street Banks. But, just as Europe's bail-out has left Greece worse off than when the crisis began, Bernanke's bail-out has left the banks in worse shape. Still, I wouldn't put all the blame on Bernanke. The famous "Greenspan put" which created the housing bubble set the stage for the 2008 crisis that Bernanke purported to cure.

But I also don't think Stiglitz is the guy with the answers either. From what I understand he's largely a "tax the rich" guy. Fine. And then what? Such a plan would be a spit in the ocean compared to what really needs to be done.
 
Harry Dent and/or Peter Schiff would tell you just the opposite. That we are about to experience deflation in the near future.

As I currently understand it, there are 2 major forces right now. The first force is the creation of money Boneyard mentions in the OP. But the second force is the serious low oil price we have because of Saudia Arabia and will get even lower because of Iran's successful negotiation with Obama. Low oil causes everything to get cheaper and also causes unemployment in the oil and steel making sectors. Real unemployment is much higher than stated and the middle class people who do have jobs do not see a robust economy to go out and consume. Add to that fact that no one is getting interest so no one is earning money on savings anymore.

Then to makes things even more complex then they already are, our government has been instrumental causing gold price to be lower than it should by selling huge amounts of paper shorts at night.

I don't see how anyone can predict what will happen at this point.

I think you're a bit confused. Harry Dent is predicting deflation and Schiff is predicting inflation. They are in the same chapter, but they're definitely not on the same page. I don't see how anyone predict this with confidence. It depends on how policy makers will respond. Dent and Schiff disagree on the future because they disagree on what they expect policy makers to do. I think that's getting into crystal ball territory so I've just outlined some scenarios.

The low oil price is not hurting the situation. It's helping it. Low oil prices are bad for a major oil exporter like Russia, but for us it's nice little bonus. Yes, it's bad for the fracking industry, and that was one of the few growth areas that we had. Nevertheless, the low oil price frees up money for consumers, and the US economy is heavily consumer-based. Of course, people aren't consuming because they're too heavily loaded down with debt. That's the consequence of blowing up too many bubbles. So we can thank Bernanke and Greenspan for that.

But I think we can also thank Bush and Obama. The Fed likes to boast about its' independence, but I think that's a fraud. The Fed does what the White House wants. Fed Chairman do not want to meet the fate that befell William Miller. They want to be re-appointed.
 
Harry Dent and/or Peter Schiff would tell you just the opposite. That we are about to experience deflation in the near future.

As I currently understand it, there are 2 major forces right now. The first force is the creation of money Boneyard mentions in the OP. But the second force is the serious low oil price we have because of Saudia Arabia and will get even lower because of Iran's successful negotiation with Obama. Low oil causes everything to get cheaper and also causes unemployment in the oil and steel making sectors. Real unemployment is much higher than stated and the middle class people who do have jobs do not see a robust economy to go out and consume. Add to that fact that no one is getting interest so no one is earning money on savings anymore.

Then to makes things even more complex then they already are, our government has been instrumental causing gold price to be lower than it should by selling huge amounts of paper shorts at night.

I don't see how anyone can predict what will happen at this point.

The gold price has been insanely high for decades. The only thing propping it up is that everyone in the market knows that everyone else in the market is batshit insane.

Gold is useful in small quantities for jewelery, dental prostheses, optical coatings, some electronic components, and decoration (gold leaf). None of these uses could possibly ever soak up the amount of refined gold currently stored in vaults worldwide; that gold is valuable for no reason other than that people have decided to value it. It will never, ever, be used for any purpose; it will sit in vaults until people realise it is inherently valueless, and then it will presumably be stacked up somewhere where people who want some can help themselves.

Of course, that doesn't mean you can get rich by shorting gold; The market can remain irrational for far longer than you can remain solvent.

Printing money raises prices. That includes the price of gold.
 
The gold price has been insanely high for decades. The only thing propping it up is that everyone in the market knows that everyone else in the market is batshit insane.

Gold is useful in small quantities for jewelery, dental prostheses, optical coatings, some electronic components, and decoration (gold leaf). None of these uses could possibly ever soak up the amount of refined gold currently stored in vaults worldwide; that gold is valuable for no reason other than that people have decided to value it. It will never, ever, be used for any purpose; it will sit in vaults until people realise it is inherently valueless, and then it will presumably be stacked up somewhere where people who want some can help themselves.

Of course, that doesn't mean you can get rich by shorting gold; The market can remain irrational for far longer than you can remain solvent.

Printing money raises prices. That includes the price of gold.

No shit, Sherlock.

That doesn't change the fact that the massive oversupply of refined gold in the world today, that cannot conceivably be used in thousands of years, should (if markets were sane) render that particular commodity almost valueless. That it is not selling for pennies a tonne is purely an artefact of human cognitive impairment - literally, insanity.

Sure, if there is inflation, the price of all commodities - including those that are practically valueless - should, all else being equal, rise; but any number multiplied by almost nothing is almost nothing.

If the world had thousands of years supply of refined steel ingots in storage, doing nothing, what do you think that would do to the price of steel, iron, and iron ore? For sure, nobody would be interested in mining more iron ore. But gold mines worldwide are producing over 3,000 tonnes of the stuff each year - to be refined, cast into ingots, and placed into storage, along with the other over 180,000 tonnes that is already there. The owners of the stuff never even go to look at it. That's fucking insane.
 
Printing money raises prices. That includes the price of gold.

No shit, Sherlock.

That doesn't change the fact that the massive oversupply of refined gold in the world today, that cannot conceivably be used in thousands of years, should (if markets were sane) render that particular commodity almost valueless. That it is not selling for pennies a tonne is purely an artefact of human cognitive impairment - literally, insanity.

Sure, if there is inflation, the price of all commodities - including those that are practically valueless - should, all else being equal, rise; but any number multiplied by almost nothing is almost nothing.

If the world had thousands of years supply of refined steel ingots in storage, doing nothing, what do you think that would do to the price of steel, iron, and iron ore? For sure, nobody would be interested in mining more iron ore. But gold mines worldwide are producing over 3,000 tonnes of the stuff each year - to be refined, cast into ingots, and placed into storage, along with the other over 180,000 tonnes that is already there. The owners of the stuff never even go to look at it. That's fucking insane.

If it's insane, why are they doing it? China is mining gold at a loss and refusing to sell any of it. Meanwhile, they're buying all the gold they can get their hands on. Russia is also buying gold and so is India.

You left out one important function for gold. It is very useful as a medium of exchange. We have paper dollars! You might exclaim. But paper dollars are very cheap to produce and accounting entries (which is most of what our money is) are even cheaper.

Consider this, when we were on a gold standard, the gold actually served an immediate, practical purpose. It served as a medium of exchange. Even though it mostly never left the vaults, it served as security for the bank notes that people actually used in their transactions.

Fiat money has no security. Consequently people seeking security will turn to gold and silver in direct proportion to their lack of confidence in the prevailing fiat currencies. The high price of gold is a symptom of the declining confidence in the major fiat currencies of world and of the dollar in particular.

And by the way, if you think the price of gold on the COMEX is ridiculously high, keep in mind that you can't actually buy gold at that price. The COMEX price is the price for gold contracts not real, physical gold. Real, physical gold is selling at a 30-50% premium over the COMEX price.
 
No shit, Sherlock.

That doesn't change the fact that the massive oversupply of refined gold in the world today, that cannot conceivably be used in thousands of years, should (if markets were sane) render that particular commodity almost valueless. That it is not selling for pennies a tonne is purely an artefact of human cognitive impairment - literally, insanity.

Sure, if there is inflation, the price of all commodities - including those that are practically valueless - should, all else being equal, rise; but any number multiplied by almost nothing is almost nothing.

If the world had thousands of years supply of refined steel ingots in storage, doing nothing, what do you think that would do to the price of steel, iron, and iron ore? For sure, nobody would be interested in mining more iron ore. But gold mines worldwide are producing over 3,000 tonnes of the stuff each year - to be refined, cast into ingots, and placed into storage, along with the other over 180,000 tonnes that is already there. The owners of the stuff never even go to look at it. That's fucking insane.

If it's insane, why are they doing it?
Because it works as long as everyone else is equally crazy.
China is mining gold at a loss and refusing to sell any of it. Meanwhile, they're buying all the gold they can get their hands on. Russia is also buying gold and so is India.
So what? Lots of people do insane things.
You left out one important function for gold. It is very useful as a medium of exchange.
No it isn't.
We have paper dollars! You might exclaim. But paper dollars are very cheap to produce and accounting entries (which is most of what our money is) are even cheaper.
Exactly. Cheaper things are good. Expensive things cost more. If you have two ways to do something, the non-insane option is to go with the cheaper.
Consider this, when we were on a gold standard, the gold actually served an immediate, practical purpose.
Indeed it did. And in the neolithic, good quality flints were hugely prized, for good reasons. But we are no longer in the neolithic, nor are we on the gold standard.
It served as a medium of exchange. Even though it mostly never left the vaults, it served as security for the bank notes that people actually used in their transactions.
And instability, deflationary spirals, recessions and all kinds of needless economic harm resulted. Fortunately, we have moved on since then; fractional reserve banking allows money supply to automatically match to demand - when people want to borrow, money is created, instead of having to be diverted from other economic purposes; and when they pay back the loan, that money disappears again, instead of hanging around causing inflation.

There is no way to match the supply of gold to the demand for money. That makes commodity money a truly bad idea.
Fiat money has no security.
Nor does gold. Did you miss the part where I pointed out that there are 180,000 tonnes of refined gold sitting idle around the world? It is worthless as soon as people decide it is - just like fiat money.
Consequently people seeking security will turn to gold and silver in direct proportion to their lack of confidence in the prevailing fiat currencies.
But they don't - they turn to other fiat currencies. The Zimbabweans dropped their dollar for the greenback, not for golden krugerands. There is a reason for this.
The high price of gold is a symptom of the declining confidence in the major fiat currencies of world and of the dollar in particular.
It is a symptom of people's faith in each other's insanity.

And by the way, if you think the price of gold on the COMEX is ridiculously high, keep in mind that you can't actually buy gold at that price. The COMEX price is the price for gold contracts not real, physical gold. Real, physical gold is selling at a 30-50% premium over the COMEX price.
So what? More insanity.

The key difference between gold and fiat money is the fiat money is backed by real nation states, with real economies. Gold is backed by the crazy idea that it is valuable in and of itself, despite being practically useless and in massive oversupply.
 
If it's insane, why are they doing it?
Because it works as long as everyone else is equally crazy.
China is mining gold at a loss and refusing to sell any of it. Meanwhile, they're buying all the gold they can get their hands on. Russia is also buying gold and so is India.
So what? Lots of people do insane things.
You left out one important function for gold. It is very useful as a medium of exchange.
No it isn't.
We have paper dollars! You might exclaim. But paper dollars are very cheap to produce and accounting entries (which is most of what our money is) are even cheaper.
Exactly. Cheaper things are good. Expensive things cost more. If you have two ways to do something, the non-insane option is to go with the cheaper.
Consider this, when we were on a gold standard, the gold actually served an immediate, practical purpose.
Indeed it did. And in the neolithic, good quality flints were hugely prized, for good reasons. But we are no longer in the neolithic, nor are we on the gold standard.
It served as a medium of exchange. Even though it mostly never left the vaults, it served as security for the bank notes that people actually used in their transactions.
And instability, deflationary spirals, recessions and all kinds of needless economic harm resulted. Fortunately, we have moved on since then; fractional reserve banking allows money supply to automatically match to demand - when people want to borrow, money is created, instead of having to be diverted from other economic purposes; and when they pay back the loan, that money disappears again, instead of hanging around causing inflation.

There is no way to match the supply of gold to the demand for money. That makes commodity money a truly bad idea.
Fiat money has no security.
Nor does gold. Did you miss the part where I pointed out that there are 180,000 tonnes of refined gold sitting idle around the world? It is worthless as soon as people decide it is - just like fiat money.
Consequently people seeking security will turn to gold and silver in direct proportion to their lack of confidence in the prevailing fiat currencies.
But they don't - they turn to other fiat currencies. The Zimbabweans dropped their dollar for the greenback, not for golden krugerands. There is a reason for this.
The high price of gold is a symptom of the declining confidence in the major fiat currencies of world and of the dollar in particular.
It is a symptom of people's faith in each other's insanity.

And by the way, if you think the price of gold on the COMEX is ridiculously high, keep in mind that you can't actually buy gold at that price. The COMEX price is the price for gold contracts not real, physical gold. Real, physical gold is selling at a 30-50% premium over the COMEX price.
So what? More insanity.

The key difference between gold and fiat money is the fiat money is backed by real nation states, with real economies. Gold is backed by the crazy idea that it is valuable in and of itself, despite being practically useless and in massive oversupply.

I'm not going to respond to each individual point because I don't want to descend into a de-rail. I would only point out that fractional reserve lending was invented when a gold standard prevailed and is not incompatible with a gold standard. But I would also suggest that equating a medium of exchange with supply and demand is rather wrong-headed. You seem to have fallen into that modern neo-Keynesian trap of equating "demand" with money. That makes no sense. Money is a medium of exchange through with supply and demand are expressed.

Of course, if there is a shortage of money, prices will fall. It isn't the money balances the two. It is the price mechanism.

Meanwhile, you are left with the choice of believing that the entire world is insane or that you are wrong.
 
Because it works as long as everyone else is equally crazy.
China is mining gold at a loss and refusing to sell any of it. Meanwhile, they're buying all the gold they can get their hands on. Russia is also buying gold and so is India.
So what? Lots of people do insane things.
You left out one important function for gold. It is very useful as a medium of exchange.
No it isn't.
We have paper dollars! You might exclaim. But paper dollars are very cheap to produce and accounting entries (which is most of what our money is) are even cheaper.
Exactly. Cheaper things are good. Expensive things cost more. If you have two ways to do something, the non-insane option is to go with the cheaper.
Consider this, when we were on a gold standard, the gold actually served an immediate, practical purpose.
Indeed it did. And in the neolithic, good quality flints were hugely prized, for good reasons. But we are no longer in the neolithic, nor are we on the gold standard.
It served as a medium of exchange. Even though it mostly never left the vaults, it served as security for the bank notes that people actually used in their transactions.
And instability, deflationary spirals, recessions and all kinds of needless economic harm resulted. Fortunately, we have moved on since then; fractional reserve banking allows money supply to automatically match to demand - when people want to borrow, money is created, instead of having to be diverted from other economic purposes; and when they pay back the loan, that money disappears again, instead of hanging around causing inflation.

There is no way to match the supply of gold to the demand for money. That makes commodity money a truly bad idea.
Fiat money has no security.
Nor does gold. Did you miss the part where I pointed out that there are 180,000 tonnes of refined gold sitting idle around the world? It is worthless as soon as people decide it is - just like fiat money.
Consequently people seeking security will turn to gold and silver in direct proportion to their lack of confidence in the prevailing fiat currencies.
But they don't - they turn to other fiat currencies. The Zimbabweans dropped their dollar for the greenback, not for golden krugerands. There is a reason for this.
The high price of gold is a symptom of the declining confidence in the major fiat currencies of world and of the dollar in particular.
It is a symptom of people's faith in each other's insanity.

And by the way, if you think the price of gold on the COMEX is ridiculously high, keep in mind that you can't actually buy gold at that price. The COMEX price is the price for gold contracts not real, physical gold. Real, physical gold is selling at a 30-50% premium over the COMEX price.
So what? More insanity.

The key difference between gold and fiat money is the fiat money is backed by real nation states, with real economies. Gold is backed by the crazy idea that it is valuable in and of itself, despite being practically useless and in massive oversupply.

I'm not going to respond to each individual point because I don't want to descend into a de-rail. I would only point out that fractional reserve lending was invented when a gold standard prevailed and is not incompatible with a gold standard. But I would also suggest that equating a medium of exchange with supply and demand is rather wrong-headed. You seem to have fallen into that modern neo-Keynesian trap of equating "demand" with money. That makes no sense. Money is a medium of exchange through with supply and demand are expressed.

Of course, if there is a shortage of money, prices will fall. It isn't the money balances the two. It is the price mechanism.

Meanwhile, you are left with the choice of believing that the entire world is insane or that you are wrong.

I am given that choice quite frequently. Every time so far, it has turned out that I was right.

I am no longer surprised one iota by the insanity of the world; For fuck's sake, most of them believe that the universe was made for them by a super-being (or beings) and that they will never die, but will instead go to visit the super-being, or be re-born in a new body, when they have finished with their present bodies. Against that level of crazy, a mere belief in the inherent value of a worthless yellow metal is hardly worthy of comment.
 
I think BB was asleep in 2008 when the global economy imploded and if weren't for substantial international Government involvement and cooperation, the global economy would still be in ashes.
 
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