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Does Hell Exist?

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A Response to the Skeptic's Annotated Bible (SAB) - Does Hell Exist?

The answer to the question is no. Hell as most people know it is a Christian adoption of pagan mythology, and isn't a Biblical teaching. The skeptic points out three possible interpretations. Those that don't go to heaven are tormented forever in hell; Those that don't go to heaven, just die; and Everyone goes to heaven after they die. None of these are correct Biblical teachings. The Bible teaches that a few people go to heaven to judge and rule with Christ Jesus, the rest of the people who have ever (or will ever have) lived will either live forever in paradise Earth or suffer everlasting destruction. Not a literal torment, as in hell, but a simple death.​

SAB: Yes, God tortures some people forever after they die.

No. Not literally. The Greek basanizo or related terms, can mean being restrained, as in Matthew 18:34 where the tormentors are jailers. (See Revelation reference below in this section #2) In modern colloquialism it is similar to telling someone if they jump off a cliff, they'll be sorry, not meaning sorry in a literal sense because they'll be dead. Romans 6:7. (Compare Translations) The wages of sin are death.

Daniel 12:2 doesn't convey the idea of hell. The meek shall inherit the earth and the disobedient will be destroyed.

Matthew 13:41-42 is a parable about the harvesting of crops after the weeds have been burned, beginning in verse 39. Jesus compares the disobedient to the weeds that would have been thrown into the fire and burned so that the crop may live. Fire was, in Bible times, the most thorough means of destruction.

Matthew 18:8-9 is a reference to Gehenna. Gehenna was a literal place which came to represent spiritual destruction. A figurative everlasting fire.

Matthew 22:1-14, the illustration of the marriage feast, is actually a pretty good account of Christianity. The King (God) invites his subjects (Jews) to the marriage feast of his son (Christ) and bride to be (anointed 144, 000) but they refuse. The first call went out from 29 - 33 CE during missionary work of Jesus' disciples (the King's slaves). The second call began at the wedding dinner (Pentecost 33 CE) and continued to 36 CE but still the subjects refused and even began to kill the slaves of the King. He became enraged and his armies destroyed them (70 CE). Since the subjects of the King had refused, he sent his slaves outside of the city (Jerusalem) to gather any who would attend (Gentiles) beginning in 36 CE. First the Roman army officer Cornelius and his family and continuing to this day. The man without the wedding garment is the apostate, who will be removed and thrown into the darkness. Which brings us to the next verse given by the skeptic:

Matthew 25:41, 46 - Verse 41 is a reference to the lake of fire which is symbolic of everlasting destruction and verse 46 is interesting in that the KJV uses the term everlasting punishment, or in other translations, cutting off. From the Greek kolasin, which literally means "lopping off or pruning."

Mark 9:43-48 is a reference to Gehenna, mentioned above. Gehenna was a literal place which came to represent spiritual destruction. A figurative everlasting fire.

Luke 16:22-24 is the illustration of Lazarus and the rich man. It isn't a literal/historical account. Jesus would later say that no man had ascended to heaven. (John 3:13)

John 5:28-29 in the KJV is a pretty poor translation. Compare John 5:29. Damnation comes from the Greek anastasin kriseos and the Latin resurrectionem iudicii, far more accurately translated as "judgment" or "resurrection to judgment." It is a reference to the resurrection of the unrighteous. (Acts 24:15) Those who have not been given the opportunity to know Jehovah God, though unrighteous, will be resurrected and given the opportunity to do so.

2 Thessalonians 1:8-9 deals with the judicial punishment of everlasting destruction of the disobedient.

Revelation 14:10-11; 20:10; Revelation 20:14-15 indicates that the wicked are tormented, from the Greek basanizo or related terms, which can mean being restrained, as in Matthew 18:34 where the "tormentors" are "jailers."

SAB: No, those that don't go to heaven, just die.

This is actually the closest interpretation to the truth according to the Bible. If it were reworded to say those that don't go to heaven or live forever on earth just die it would be correct.

Deuteronomy 29:20 - The book of God's remembrance is used throughout scripture to symbolize him taking note of those who are righteous and those who are not. The righteous to live and the unrighteous to die. This doesn't indicate that the righteous go to heaven or the unrighteous to hell, but that the meek shall inherit the Earth and live forever upon it and the unrighteous will suffer everlasting destruction. Death.

Psalm 1:4-6 - Interesting because the Hebrew word here translated as wind is the Hebrew ruach, which can also be translated as spirit. Not that this implies some spiritual connotation - quite the contrast - ruach simply means any invisible active force like breath, wind, or spirit. Like chaff, the thin covering on wheat and barley which is blown away with the wind after harvest the ungodly will be "blown away" in the end. Useless to a perfect creation without sin.

Psalm 34:16 - Interesting that the "remembrance" being removed can also be translated as the "mention" of them being removed. They are no longer remembered or talked about. Dissolved along with their sin.

Psalm 37:1-2; 37:20 refers to the corrupt evildoers who, through injustice and malice advance while the righteous gain nothing through wrongdoing. Those who rape, murder, steal, cheat and lie to get what they want corrupt the system, or world. Their demise would cease this destructive pattern.

Psalm 69:28 again refers to the book of life, those noted by God as deserving of life in a perfected heaven and earth, free from sin.

Proverbs 10:25 is a variation of both the chaff in the wind and the end of sin, death and destruction. The results of sin may seem like a storm now, but there are better days ahead.

Proverbs 24:20 reflects the sentiment in some verses mentioned earlier. Not only will the wicked be destroyed but the illumination of their works will be a thing of the past. Their corrupt system ended along with its effects.

Obadiah 1:16 - Again, the remembrance and mention of them will be no more. Forgotten.

Romans 6:21, 23 indicate an end to sin, which is disobedience to Jehovah, the creator, and brings death. These are interesting scriptures in the context of a discussion about hell, because if the wages of sin are death, then at death the debt of sin is paid in full. To suffer beyond that in a literal fiery torment would be overcharging. Romans 6:7 makes it clear when it says: "For he who has died has been acquitted from [his] sin."

1 Corinthians 3:17 - It is important to realize what exactly is meant here by the "temple" or "church" of God. It isn't, of course, a building which houses a congregation. It is the congregation itself. The people. As 1 Corinthians 3:9, 16 indicates. In addition to persecutors this may also apply to apostate Christianity who spiritually destroy God's true congregation.

2 Corinthians 2:15-16 - The Roman soldiers would parade victorious through the city of Rome and burn incense in the altars, perfuming the air. To the Romans it was a sweet smell representing honor, promotion and riches. But to their captives it represented the unpleasant reminder that they would be executed at the end of the parade. Likewise, to those who accepted the Christian message and those who reject the message.

Galatians 6:8 - The indulgence of sinful human desires corrupts one in a way that leads to death.

Philippians 3:18-19 - These verses properly convey the idea that the sinful will be destroyed, but don't imply that the righteous will all go to heaven. On an unrelated note, the KJV uses the word cross where torture stake or pole should have been used. Jesus didn't die on a cross.

James 1:15 - A sinful nature leads to destruction and death. Through sin we all die, but if, during a brief life in faith, we avoid a sinful nature which corrupts the spirit as well as the flesh and so there is the hope of a resurrection to eternal life without sin rather than eternal destruction.

James 4:12 - Not everyone agrees with the morality dictated by the lawgiver, whether God or man, but as men we have no authority to question the morality of God. We may still not agree, but God the lawgiver has the authority to judge.

James 5:20 - Interesting because some Christians think that being "saved" is predestined, but this verse along with others considered in this article indicate that the sinful can turn back from destructive ways, and the righteous can turn to sinful ways.

SAB: No, everyone goes to heaven after they die.

1 Corinthians 15:12 - This chapter isn't dealing with mankind in general, but rather only those who have "fallen asleep in death in union with Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:18.

1 Timothy 4:10 - Christ gave himself a corresponding ransom for all, but not all will accept it. 1 Timothy 4:10 points this out. Paul said that Jesus was a savior for all men, potentially, but specifically for the faithful.

1 John 2:2 - "Our sins" refers to the sins of the anointed Christians (144, 000) like John himself, who would judge in heaven with Christ, but also the people of the world who have the possibility of resurrection to everlasting life in paradise earth.

SAB: No, everyone dies. There is no heaven or hell.

Put simply, the Biblical words heaven and hell mean, respectively, high and grave.

Joshua 23:14 - Joshua was dying with the hope of resurrection. God is in hell in the sense that his attention is fixed upon the grave to resurrect the faithful. Like Joshua. (Ecclesiastes 9:10; Amos 9:1-2 Compare; Proverbs 15:11; Psalm 139:8 Compare)

Job 7:9; 14:10-14; 20:7 - At Job 7:9 Job may have been referring to the permanence of death in this world or he might have been pointing out that resurrection was out of his control. At Job 14:10 there is some variation between the Masoretic Hebrew texts and the Septuagint. The former says "Where is he?" and the latter says "he is no more." Compare Job 14:10. But, interestingly, at Job 20:7 there is no such variation. One thing is sure, Job believed in the possibility of resurrection. (Job 14:13-15)

Psalm 6:5; 31:17; Psalm 88:5; 115:17; Ecclesiastes 3:19-21; Ecclesiastes 9:2-6; Isaiah 38:18 all have to do with death and the grave. In the case of hell, it is really easy to sort the theological - the pagan influenced apostate Christian doctrine - from the scriptural truth.

First, the wages of sin are death, not a literal torment in hell. (Romans 6:7) The soul is mortal/destructable so it can't be tortured literally forever in hell. (Ezekiel 18:4 compare; Matthew 10:28) The Biblical soul is the life/blood of any breathing animal or human. The Hebrew word translated soul literally means "breather." The immaterial soul of pagan origin, (Socrates/Plato) as well as spirit creatures - Satan and his demons - wouldn't be harmed by literal fire. (Exodus 3:2) Hell and death are thrown into the figurative lake of fire which is symbolic of everlasting destruction. Meaning they are no more. Destroyed. (Revelation 20:14) The meek inherit everlasting life on earth. (Psalm 37:11; Matthew 5:5)
 

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DLH tried to make hay with evolution and creationism.

Now he is on to Hell. The bible has been a deep well for 2000 years and counting. Debunking Christian theory in favor of an assumed singular Jewish biblical belief, which does not exist.

As I do not believe in any god and related beliefs any concept of afterlife of a heaven or hell is at best metaphor for life experiences and emotional states.

The OT such as it is does not represent a consistent single theology. The books of OT represent different Jews at different times. Similarly there is no single Christian theology.


Judaism offers a range of views on the afterlife, including some parallels to the concepts of heaven and hell familiar to us from popular Western (i.e., Christian) teachings. While in traditional Jewish thought the subjects of heaven and hell were treated extensively, most modern Jewish thinkers have shied away from this topic, preferring to follow the biblical model, which focuses on life on earth.

The Bible’s Sheol: An Underground Abyss

The subject of death is treated inconsistently in the Bible, though most often it suggests that physical death is the end of life. This is the case with such central figures as Abraham, Moses, and Miriam.

There are, however, several biblical references to a place called Sheol (cf. Numbers 30, 33). It is described as a region “dark and deep,” “the Pit,” and “the Land of Forgetfulness,” where human beings descend after death. The suggestion is that in the netherworld of Sheol, the deceased, although cut off from God and humankind, live on in some shadowy state of existence.

While this vision of Sheol is rather bleak (setting precedents for later Jewish and Christian ideas of an underground hell) there is generally no concept of judgment or reward and punishment attached to it. In fact, the more pessimistic books of the Bible, such as Ecclesiastes and Job, insist that all of the dead go down to Sheol, whether good or evil, rich or poor, slave or free man (Job 3:11-19).
 
If you die in battle, will you end up in Valhalla?
If you say enough mantras to Kali, will she bring you enlightenment?
Did Xenu actually bring billions of people to earth in a spacecraft 75 million years ago, then kill them with hydrogen bombs?
If Rapunzel had hair that went from the top of a tower to the ground, what about her pubes? And did the carpets match the drapes?
Will forcing your wife to drink water and dirt from the temple floor reveal if she is a faithful wife?
If you do a feast for Snotra, will she protect you from rash decisions? (Note, I did not make up Snotra. Snotra is actually the one goddess I might agree to worship, just 'cause I'd like to tell the good news about Snotra to all who would listen. Snotra saves.)

Why aren't these key questions being addressed? Inquiring minds want to know.
Snotra.
 
If you die in battle, will you end up in Valhalla?
If you say enough mantras to Kali, will she bring you enlightenment?
Did Xenu actually bring billions of people to earth in a spacecraft 75 million years ago, then kill them with hydrogen bombs?
If Rapunzel had hair that went from the top of a tower to the ground, what about her pubes? And did the carpets match the drapes?
Will forcing your wife to drink water and dirt from the temple floor reveal if she is a faithful wife?
If you do a feast for Snotra, will she protect you from rash decisions? (Note, I did not make up Snotra. Snotra is actually the one goddess I might agree to worship, just 'cause I'd like to tell the good news about Snotra to all who would listen. Snotra saves.)

Why aren't these key questions being addressed? Inquiring minds want to know.
Snotra.

In typical fashion the ignorant atheist suggests that the possession of my beliefs negates all other beliefs when in fact that is what they themselves are doing.

You want to discuss any of the above? Present the case. Each individual decides the veracity.
 
View attachment 50115

A Response to the Skeptic's Annotated Bible (SAB) - Does Hell Exist?

The answer to the question is no. Hell as most people know it is a Christian adoption of pagan mythology, and isn't a Biblical teaching. The skeptic points out three possible interpretations. Those that don't go to heaven are tormented forever in hell; Those that don't go to heaven, just die; and Everyone goes to heaven after they die. None of these are correct Biblical teachings. The Bible teaches that a few people go to heaven to judge and rule with Christ Jesus, the rest of the people who have ever (or will ever have) lived will either live forever in paradise Earth or suffer everlasting destruction. Not a literal torment, as in hell, but a simple death.​

SAB: Yes, God tortures some people forever after they die.

No. Not literally. The Greek basanizo or related terms, can mean being restrained, as in Matthew 18:34 where the tormentors are jailers. (See Revelation reference below in this section #2) In modern colloquialism it is similar to telling someone if they jump off a cliff, they'll be sorry, not meaning sorry in a literal sense because they'll be dead. Romans 6:7. (Compare Translations) The wages of sin are death.

Daniel 12:2 doesn't convey the idea of hell. The meek shall inherit the earth and the disobedient will be destroyed.

Matthew 13:41-42 is a parable about the harvesting of crops after the weeds have been burned, beginning in verse 39. Jesus compares the disobedient to the weeds that would have been thrown into the fire and burned so that the crop may live. Fire was, in Bible times, the most thorough means of destruction.

Matthew 18:8-9 is a reference to Gehenna. Gehenna was a literal place which came to represent spiritual destruction. A figurative everlasting fire.

Matthew 22:1-14, the illustration of the marriage feast, is actually a pretty good account of Christianity. The King (God) invites his subjects (Jews) to the marriage feast of his son (Christ) and bride to be (anointed 144, 000) but they refuse. The first call went out from 29 - 33 CE during missionary work of Jesus' disciples (the King's slaves). The second call began at the wedding dinner (Pentecost 33 CE) and continued to 36 CE but still the subjects refused and even began to kill the slaves of the King. He became enraged and his armies destroyed them (70 CE). Since the subjects of the King had refused, he sent his slaves outside of the city (Jerusalem) to gather any who would attend (Gentiles) beginning in 36 CE. First the Roman army officer Cornelius and his family and continuing to this day. The man without the wedding garment is the apostate, who will be removed and thrown into the darkness. Which brings us to the next verse given by the skeptic:

Matthew 25:41, 46 - Verse 41 is a reference to the lake of fire which is symbolic of everlasting destruction and verse 46 is interesting in that the KJV uses the term everlasting punishment, or in other translations, cutting off. From the Greek kolasin, which literally means "lopping off or pruning."

Mark 9:43-48 is a reference to Gehenna, mentioned above. Gehenna was a literal place which came to represent spiritual destruction. A figurative everlasting fire.

Luke 16:22-24 is the illustration of Lazarus and the rich man. It isn't a literal/historical account. Jesus would later say that no man had ascended to heaven. (John 3:13)

John 5:28-29 in the KJV is a pretty poor translation. Compare John 5:29. Damnation comes from the Greek anastasin kriseos and the Latin resurrectionem iudicii, far more accurately translated as "judgment" or "resurrection to judgment." It is a reference to the resurrection of the unrighteous. (Acts 24:15) Those who have not been given the opportunity to know Jehovah God, though unrighteous, will be resurrected and given the opportunity to do so.

2 Thessalonians 1:8-9 deals with the judicial punishment of everlasting destruction of the disobedient.

Revelation 14:10-11; 20:10; Revelation 20:14-15 indicates that the wicked are tormented, from the Greek basanizo or related terms, which can mean being restrained, as in Matthew 18:34 where the "tormentors" are "jailers."

SAB: No, those that don't go to heaven, just die.

This is actually the closest interpretation to the truth according to the Bible. If it were reworded to say those that don't go to heaven or live forever on earth just die it would be correct.

Deuteronomy 29:20 - The book of God's remembrance is used throughout scripture to symbolize him taking note of those who are righteous and those who are not. The righteous to live and the unrighteous to die. This doesn't indicate that the righteous go to heaven or the unrighteous to hell, but that the meek shall inherit the Earth and live forever upon it and the unrighteous will suffer everlasting destruction. Death.

Psalm 1:4-6 - Interesting because the Hebrew word here translated as wind is the Hebrew ruach, which can also be translated as spirit. Not that this implies some spiritual connotation - quite the contrast - ruach simply means any invisible active force like breath, wind, or spirit. Like chaff, the thin covering on wheat and barley which is blown away with the wind after harvest the ungodly will be "blown away" in the end. Useless to a perfect creation without sin.

Psalm 34:16 - Interesting that the "remembrance" being removed can also be translated as the "mention" of them being removed. They are no longer remembered or talked about. Dissolved along with their sin.

Psalm 37:1-2; 37:20 refers to the corrupt evildoers who, through injustice and malice advance while the righteous gain nothing through wrongdoing. Those who rape, murder, steal, cheat and lie to get what they want corrupt the system, or world. Their demise would cease this destructive pattern.

Psalm 69:28 again refers to the book of life, those noted by God as deserving of life in a perfected heaven and earth, free from sin.

Proverbs 10:25 is a variation of both the chaff in the wind and the end of sin, death and destruction. The results of sin may seem like a storm now, but there are better days ahead.

Proverbs 24:20 reflects the sentiment in some verses mentioned earlier. Not only will the wicked be destroyed but the illumination of their works will be a thing of the past. Their corrupt system ended along with its effects.

Obadiah 1:16 - Again, the remembrance and mention of them will be no more. Forgotten.

Romans 6:21, 23 indicate an end to sin, which is disobedience to Jehovah, the creator, and brings death. These are interesting scriptures in the context of a discussion about hell, because if the wages of sin are death, then at death the debt of sin is paid in full. To suffer beyond that in a literal fiery torment would be overcharging. Romans 6:7 makes it clear when it says: "For he who has died has been acquitted from [his] sin."

1 Corinthians 3:17 - It is important to realize what exactly is meant here by the "temple" or "church" of God. It isn't, of course, a building which houses a congregation. It is the congregation itself. The people. As 1 Corinthians 3:9, 16 indicates. In addition to persecutors this may also apply to apostate Christianity who spiritually destroy God's true congregation.

2 Corinthians 2:15-16 - The Roman soldiers would parade victorious through the city of Rome and burn incense in the altars, perfuming the air. To the Romans it was a sweet smell representing honor, promotion and riches. But to their captives it represented the unpleasant reminder that they would be executed at the end of the parade. Likewise, to those who accepted the Christian message and those who reject the message.

Galatians 6:8 - The indulgence of sinful human desires corrupts one in a way that leads to death.

Philippians 3:18-19 - These verses properly convey the idea that the sinful will be destroyed, but don't imply that the righteous will all go to heaven. On an unrelated note, the KJV uses the word cross where torture stake or pole should have been used. Jesus didn't die on a cross.

James 1:15 - A sinful nature leads to destruction and death. Through sin we all die, but if, during a brief life in faith, we avoid a sinful nature which corrupts the spirit as well as the flesh and so there is the hope of a resurrection to eternal life without sin rather than eternal destruction.

James 4:12 - Not everyone agrees with the morality dictated by the lawgiver, whether God or man, but as men we have no authority to question the morality of God. We may still not agree, but God the lawgiver has the authority to judge.

James 5:20 - Interesting because some Christians think that being "saved" is predestined, but this verse along with others considered in this article indicate that the sinful can turn back from destructive ways, and the righteous can turn to sinful ways.

SAB: No, everyone goes to heaven after they die.

1 Corinthians 15:12 - This chapter isn't dealing with mankind in general, but rather only those who have "fallen asleep in death in union with Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:18.

1 Timothy 4:10 - Christ gave himself a corresponding ransom for all, but not all will accept it. 1 Timothy 4:10 points this out. Paul said that Jesus was a savior for all men, potentially, but specifically for the faithful.

1 John 2:2 - "Our sins" refers to the sins of the anointed Christians (144, 000) like John himself, who would judge in heaven with Christ, but also the people of the world who have the possibility of resurrection to everlasting life in paradise earth.

SAB: No, everyone dies. There is no heaven or hell.

Put simply, the Biblical words heaven and hell mean, respectively, high and grave.

Joshua 23:14 - Joshua was dying with the hope of resurrection. God is in hell in the sense that his attention is fixed upon the grave to resurrect the faithful. Like Joshua. (Ecclesiastes 9:10; Amos 9:1-2 Compare; Proverbs 15:11; Psalm 139:8 Compare)

Job 7:9; 14:10-14; 20:7 - At Job 7:9 Job may have been referring to the permanence of death in this world or he might have been pointing out that resurrection was out of his control. At Job 14:10 there is some variation between the Masoretic Hebrew texts and the Septuagint. The former says "Where is he?" and the latter says "he is no more." Compare Job 14:10. But, interestingly, at Job 20:7 there is no such variation. One thing is sure, Job believed in the possibility of resurrection. (Job 14:13-15)

Psalm 6:5; 31:17; Psalm 88:5; 115:17; Ecclesiastes 3:19-21; Ecclesiastes 9:2-6; Isaiah 38:18 all have to do with death and the grave. In the case of hell, it is really easy to sort the theological - the pagan influenced apostate Christian doctrine - from the scriptural truth.

First, the wages of sin are death, not a literal torment in hell. (Romans 6:7) The soul is mortal/destructable so it can't be tortured literally forever in hell. (Ezekiel 18:4 compare; Matthew 10:28) The Biblical soul is the life/blood of any breathing animal or human. The Hebrew word translated soul literally means "breather." The immaterial soul of pagan origin, (Socrates/Plato) as well as spirit creatures - Satan and his demons - wouldn't be harmed by literal fire. (Exodus 3:2) Hell and death are thrown into the figurative lake of fire which is symbolic of everlasting destruction. Meaning they are no more. Destroyed. (Revelation 20:14) The meek inherit everlasting life on earth. (Psalm 37:11; Matthew 5:5)
Once again, your only source for any of this is the Bible, which you claim not to specially revere, and which you admit is full of inaccuracies and contradictions. Why would we trust its word on the issue of Hell/Gehenna, a question on which it's various constituent books are very specifically and notoriously inconsistent?
 
Doom Eternal was a good game, though. Would have had more legs, if it had not had the ill fortune to come out in the same year as Ghost of Tsushima... Also, a year when most people had enough hell in their lives already and were in more of an Animal Crossing mood.
 
Once again, your only source for any of this is the Bible, which you claim not to specially revere, and which you admit is full of inaccuracies and contradictions.

Every endeavor of man suffers the indignity of imperfection. In this specific case the reader allows for the imperfection of 1. Themselves. 2. The Bible. and 3. Myself. We all "know" this so let's not pretend it's necessary to disclaim or necessarily relevant to establish one perspective over another. In presentation or reception. We choose. Having said that I will respond to your valid statements.

1. The Bible
The Bible isn't the source of hell. I have another article where this is explored in somewhat more detail; in this case, I'm responding to the Skeptic's Annotated Bible. Hell isn't a Bible teaching, it is a pagan (outside of, in this case the Bible) teaching adopted by apostate Christianity.

A. Purpose/Distinction
The purpose of the inspired infallible word of Jehovah God is specific to the time, place and people in which it was given. It served the immediate purpose of instruction to a) the ancient Israelites who were originally intended to form a nation of arbitrary laws to instruct them regarding their sin before Jehovah and the subsequent exclusive salvation from that sin through a messiah or savior. So that God's purpose for mankind would be fulfilled in the earth man would inherit and live forever upon as was intended for Adam. This was rejected and so fell upon b) the Christian. Either gentile or Jew. All of which was presented and, in a sense, established.

That having been established through the infallible world, means that now to us, in the modern-day, the Bible isn't necessary for that purpose, but rather as a guide to those who choose to use it as such. It isn't, nor does it need to be, anything other than the imperfect fallible translation of the more perfect origin.

Why would we trust its word on the issue of Hell/Gehenna, a question on which it's various constituent books are very specifically and notoriously inconsistent?

With me at least, stop projecting religious exclusion. You're talking to me, not as a representative of Christianity or any other concept. I don't suggest anyone implicitly trust the Bible or any part of it, myself or any religion, or even God. The individual person decides and their various choices shouldn't be questioned unless or until they present them in a forum like this.

So, if you have specific questions or claims of notorious inconsistency, we can reasonably discuss them. In reasonable increments.
 
Doom Eternal was a good game, though. Would have had more legs, if it had not had the ill fortune to come out in the same year as Ghost of Tsushima... Also, a year when most people had enough hell in their lives already and were in more of an Animal Crossing mood.

I have no idea what you are talking about, being as I am, more a God of War, Grand Theft Auto man myself. Is the image used in the OP from one of those you reference?
 
Doom Eternal was a good game, though. Would have had more legs, if it had not had the ill fortune to come out in the same year as Ghost of Tsushima... Also, a year when most people had enough hell in their lives already and were in more of an Animal Crossing mood.

I have no idea what you are talking about, being as I am, more a God of War, Grand Theft Auto man myself. Is the image used in the OP from one of those you reference?
No idea from whom you "borrowed" the image? I am not surprised.
 
No idea from whom you "borrowed" the image? I am not surprised.

I do know where you "borrowed" your avatar image. Word to the wise seems appropriate to many forum members here when criticizing me. If you are going to be a hypocrite at least don't be so fucking stupid about it.
 
Once again, your only source for any of this is the Bible, which you claim not to specially revere, and which you admit is full of inaccuracies and contradictions.

Every endeavor of man suffers the indignity of imperfection. In this specific case the reader allows for the imperfection of 1. Themselves. 2. The Bible. and 3. Myself. We all "know" this so let's not pretend it's necessary to disclaim or necessarily relevant to establish one perspective over another. In presentation or reception. We choose. Having said that I will respond to your valid statements.

1. The Bible
The Bible isn't the source of hell. I have another article where this is explored in somewhat more detail; in this case, I'm responding to the Skeptic's Annotated Bible. Hell isn't a Bible teaching, it is a pagan (outside of, in this case the Bible) teaching adopted by apostate Christianity.

A. Purpose/Distinction
The purpose of the inspired infallible word of Jehovah God is specific to the time, place and people in which it was given. It served the immediate purpose of instruction to a) the ancient Israelites who were originally intended to form a nation of arbitrary laws to instruct them regarding their sin before Jehovah and the subsequent exclusive salvation from that sin through a messiah or savior. So that God's purpose for mankind would be fulfilled in the earth man would inherit and live forever upon as was intended for Adam. This was rejected and so fell upon b) the Christian. Either gentile or Jew. All of which was presented and, in a sense, established.

That having been established through the infallible world, means that now to us, in the modern-day, the Bible isn't necessary for that purpose, but rather as a guide to those who choose to use it as such. It isn't, nor does it need to be, anything other than the imperfect fallible translation of the more perfect origin.

Why would we trust its word on the issue of Hell/Gehenna, a question on which it's various constituent books are very specifically and notoriously inconsistent?

With me at least, stop projecting religious exclusion. You're talking to me, not as a representative of Christianity or any other concept. I don't suggest anyone implicitly trust the Bible or any part of it, myself or any religion, or even God. The individual person decides and their various choices shouldn't be questioned unless or until they present them in a forum like this.

So, if you have specific questions or claims of notorious inconsistency, we can reasonably discuss them. In reasonable increments.
Then your OP, which cites no evidence for your views except for assorted Scriptural quotations, is pointless.
 
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Then your OP, which cites no evidence except Scriptural quotations, is pointless.

My OP, which cites no evidence except Scriptural quotations and the SAB interpretation thereof, is an article exclusively on what the SAB says about hell in the Bible.
 
Oh, and I'm a Pagan and apostate Christian myself, so your dismissal of Hell as a Pagan and apostate invention means even less to me than it would to almost any other on this forum. Why should I reject Pagan ideas anyhow? Or even treat them as in any way different from Orthodox claims? All of my best friends are heretics, and so am I. So are you, for that matter, at least in the eyes of most Christians. So that's one hell of a glass house you're chucking stones from!
 
Then your OP, which cites no evidence except Scriptural quotations, is pointless.

My OP, which cites no evidence except Scriptural quotations and the SAB interpretation thereof, is an article exclusively on what the SAB says about hell in the Bible.
To what end? What's the point?
 
No idea from whom you "borrowed" the image? I am not surprised.

I do know where you "borrowed" your avatar image. Word to the wise seems appropriate to many forum members here when criticizing me. If you are going to be a hypocrite at least don't be so fucking stupid about it.
That's no secret, and I'm happy to have a conversation about Star Wars fanart any damn day of the week.
 
Oh, and I'm a Pagan and apostate Christian myself,

Fine, unless you mean to imply that I am either Pagan, apostate or Christian you would be wrong on each count. I'm none of those things.

so your dismissal of Hell as a Pagan and apostate invention means even less to me than it would to almost any other on this forum.

So what?

Pagan invention, apostate adoption, specifically.

Why should I reject Pagan ideas anyhow?

In general? I certainly don't. Baptism, wedding rings, tombstones, wind chimes, days of the week, days of the month, the names Jesus, Jehovah, Paul.

Or even treat them as in any way different from Orthodox claims?

I don't treat them any different from orthodox claims. I don't care about orthodox claims.

All of my best friends are heretics, and so am I. So are you, for that matter, at least in the eyes of most Christians.

Certainly.

So that's one hell of a glass house you're chucking stones from!

What the fuck are you talking about? I said the SAB said this is what the Bible said.

In other words, I'm giving my interpretation of the SAB's interpretation of the apostate Christian interpretation of the Bible. Your response to that, if it were not an ideologically motivated sort of emotional knee-jerk reaction to either me personally or your projection of me as the representative of some other ideology would be worth having. It would be your interpretation of my interpretation of the SAB's interpretation of the apostate Christian interpretation of the Bible.

It isn't though.
 
I think I'll just read the SAB on my own time, if I ever become curious as to what it says. At least it doles out fewer personal insults.
 
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